Alternate Core Documents

[Viewing_Glass]

You also have to remember that elemental damage mods that have come into play as a part of weapons. Those make elemental damage much more common as well.

However, I do agree with the statement that, should the changes to the spells i suggested not come into effect, then the elemental resistance potions should probably NOT come into play as well.

However, I disagree with the idea of not adding some form of zebra martial arts, exclusive or otherwise. While zebra do have two unique creation mechanics, both of these mechanics are dependent on the GM allowing you to find what you need to make things. And if the GM says you never find green herbs for alchemy, or gems for shamanism...then those mechanics aren't worth anything, are they?

[Dance_Explosion]

And frankly, you cannot replicate Fallen Ceaser style with the perks that exist, they just don't exist at nearly that high a level to do that [which is good even the Fallen ceaser style i built is not as powerful as Zenith was but is comparable when combined with existing perks]

And as VG said, zebra's do need something that is not reliant completely on the GM give time and materials, its a bit unfair since different GM's will give a different amount of resources and time, as in Stalingrad we have very low time making playing a zebra very hard since there is never the time needed to make talismans, and cook potions, or make schematics and build inventions.

[Ghostpony]

And frankly, you cannot replicate Fallen Ceaser style with the perks that exist, they just don't exist at nearly that high a level to do that [which is good even the Fallen ceaser style i built is not as powerful as Zenith was but is comparable when combined with existing perks]

And as VG said, zebra's do need something that is not reliant completely on the GM give time and materials, its a bit unfair since different GM's will give a different amount of resources and time, as in Stalingrad we have very low time making playing a zebra very hard since there is never the time needed to make talismans, and cook potions, or make schematics and build inventions.

Given that Responce Dance what do you think of the proposed Zebra martial arts I have written up?

[Ghostpony]

Anyway. Of all additions, I am LEAST interested in adding more special things for zebras. Sigh. They already have 2 unique systems for making cool stuff. Besides, no Zebra Martial Art is described in the story except Fallen Caesar (which can be done by combining existing perks already, down to the very last armor-piercing punch) so I don't think they're necessary.

I owuld like to point out that I did not write the martial art's as Zebra exclusive. Any pony who can find the training can take an art on that list but one. And that one is an earth pony MA not a zebra one.

[Mister_Clacky]

To play Discord's advocate. To learn spells outside your unicorn's primary school requires GM discretion. Earth ponies get a single bonus perk and some invention mechanics that are GM discretion, I'm not familiar enough with the new Pegasus trick to know, but I wouldn't be surprised if learning those were GM discretion.

Availability of cyberpony parts are GM discretion.

Wanting to pile on more stuff just because the GM can limit the availability of gems and herbs doesn't seem like the most solid of footing. It's like saying that there should be a system for unicorns to spontaneously learn out of school spells just because GMs can say "No, your alteration/illusion/offense/medical pony doesn't find a book to learn Shield out of".

As a side note, there was a post a while back about giving EPs bonus perks a la the Fighter class in 3rd addition D&D. I think it was like every 5-6 levels. Right now I generally see EPs taking Egghead, a single 8 skill points still seems weak to me even with the new invention mechanics. While not overly flavorful, I like it.

[Viewing_Glass]

To play Discord's advocate. To learn spells outside your unicorn's primary school requires GM discretion. Earth ponies get a single bonus perk and some invention mechanics that are GM discretion, I'm not familiar enough with the new Pegasus trick to know, but I wouldn't be surprised if learning those were GM discretion.

Actually, a unicorn can also spontaneously learn any spell directly related to their special talent. As for the pegasus tricks, no. There is no limitation on any of the pegasus tricks that a pegasus can know. In fact, a pegasi unlocks access to all of them (at the current level they have access to) when they take the relevant perk. Only new, unique (GM created tricks) must be taught from friendly pegasi. Only Wonderbolt level maneuvers require a perk to unlock access to a single one... and even those you just take the perk to unlock them.

Availability of cyberpony parts are GM discretion.

True. But that is hardly the only special thing an Earth Pony can do with the Earth Pony only perks.

Wanting to pile on more stuff just because the GM can limit the availability of gems and herbs doesn't seem like the most solid of footing. It's like saying that there should be a system for unicorns to spontaneously learn out of school spells just because GMs can say "No, your alteration/illusion/offense/medical pony doesn't find a book to learn Shield out of".

As a side note, there was a post a while back about giving EPs bonus perks a la the Fighter class in 3rd addition D&D. I think it was like every 5-6 levels. Right now I generally see EPs taking Egghead, a single 8 skill points still seems weak to me even with the new invention mechanics. While not overly flavorful, I like it.

Eh, not too sure on the additional perk scaling. That can get easily out of hand really fast, especially with how powerful perks tend to be. It would definitely be something that needs testing.

As for the discussion at hoof, a GM can not prevent a Unicorn from casting spells (unless they choose to cut off the unicorn's horn... or use some other, similar mechanic, which is pretty bad). An EP can't be prevented from inventing things with their special talent. Even Pegasi can still do their Pegasus tricks if they have their wings crippled...they can still create a contrail. Same with Griffins/Alicorns.

[Mister_Clacky]

It could just be how it was explained to me, but as I understand additional vocation and other methods of spell learning, they open up the ability to learn spells in that school. They still need to be taught instead of spontaneously learned. As I've had explained to me, I could open the defense school and get access to defense spells, but if I want to learn shield, I need to find a book or a trainer. GM discretion. From what I understand of invention, the unique items must be cleared by the GM. Even if they 'invented' rare existing items, the part availability would be just as GM discretion as herbs and gems are. Perhaps the GMs and players I've talked to are all wrong. I know at least in one game I play, they use Madd_Mod's perks which place additional vocation in with the trained perks.

Pegasus seems to be the race without their most special attribute under the rhombus of the GM. It's not just Zebra.

[Viewing_Glass]

Actually, I wasn't talking about that. I was purely talking about the ability to accomplish the task given what they had access to it. If a unicorn has the shield spell, the only thing that stops the unicorn from casting the shield spell is the amount of strain they have. No GM discretion. Spontaneously learning a spell based on a unicorn's special talent? You don't even need access to the spell set, you just pick up the relevant perk for that spell and you are good to go.

Inventing (IE, creating a schematic that can later be used to build something) can be done simply if the Earth Pony has the time and prerequisite level in a given skill. No real GM discretion there. Now, having the prerequisite materials? I will agree, that does have some GM discretion. However, the EP, if they invent something really cool but the dice just don't seem to be rolling up the equipment? They can still sell the schematic.

Does that make sense? I might be incorrectly explaining it.

[Dance_Explosion]

Well Ghost since you asked.

I fell like its VERY perk heavy and it dosn't seem to really mesh well with the current system of the game, and some of the bonus's for the late game perks seem really crazy, like monster perks for ponies.

I personally like my own proposed perk tree's for the styles, big surprise, so i really don't think im a fair judge of it

To my understanding you have them as 10 perk trees. and i think that's crazy

Also i hate that you made a earth pony style, earth ponies shouldn't have one, its a zebra thing to fit with lore and to off set how touchy the crafting perks happen to be.

Hope i came off more constructive then critical

[TyrannisUmbra]

Also i hate that you made a earth pony style, earth ponies shouldn't have one, its a zebra thing to fit with lore and to off set how touchy the crafting perks happen to be.

I disagree. Martial Arts as a whole is definitely not a 'zebra' thing. Fallen Caesar itself as a martial art is a zebra thing. There are zebra-specific styles, but even as there are zebra-specific styles, there would also be EP-specific styles, Unicorn-specific styles, pegasus-specific styles, griffon-specific styles, seapony-specific styles, etc, etc, etc. Fallen Caesar isn't even a 'zebra-specific' style, it's a 'Legionnaire-specific' style, iirc. It was practiced specifically by zebra Legionnaires. In short: zebra soldiers were taught to fight in that style in hoof-to-hoof combat. It's a powerful combat style, but it doesn't mean that nopony else can possibly use martial arts. It's just not as widely practiced as Fallen Caesar was.