Alternate Core Documents

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Thanqol
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Thanqol » Sat May 18, 2013 4:28 am

Kkat wrote:I've temporarily added an AP cost of 30 to Weaponized Contrail. However, I am open for suggestions if there might be a more suitable cost for it.
I don't think the contrails should ever be straight up AP-based attacks, that defeats the point and makes them mediocre main combat actions. Instead contrails should be used for their area denial and tactical effects - you spend some AP to run a circle around a group of enemies, locking them in place unless they cross the Contrail wall and take damage. AP spent moving is AP spent not attacking so it balances itself out. This application makes it a very useful and cool technique that lets a super-fast Pegasus take advantage of superior speed to deny enemy mobility.

Making it a direct attack means that it's what a pegasus uses when their shotgun is out of ammo.

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Kkat
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Kkat » Sat May 18, 2013 4:45 am

Thanqol wrote:I don't think the contrails should ever be straight up AP-based attacks.
The actual contrail-producing Tricks are not. They are 0 TP, at-will effects.

[Edit] After considerable thought, I have revamped and expanded the Contrail Tricks.

The original Weaponized Contrail has been renamed Contrail Strike for clarity, as the Trick itself doesn't produce a contrail -- rather, it allows a pegasus to use her contrail as a weapon in a special attack. (There is an example of this in Fallout: Equestria during the Everfree Forest clusterfight, when one of the Wonderbolts backflips onto her contrail, kicking lightning out of it.)

The existing contrail powers have been expanded to four: Contrail (basic), Cloud Contrail (advanced), Signature Contrail (advanced), and Weaponized Contrail (expert). The new Weaponized Contrail is a rework of the former Glorious Contrail. The revision includes clarification on the use of contrails for cover/obscurement.

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Viewing_Glass
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Viewing_Glass » Sat May 18, 2013 1:42 pm

That reduction in Trick Points gained through rest should balance things out and keep Pegasi running alongside Unicorns. As for reducing the number of Trick Points a Pegasus can get...I would. Just double-checked and realized the Unicorn with a 7 Endurance and a 7 Intelligence would start at level 1 with a total of 72 strain. I would be surprised if Pegasi ended up being more magical than unicorns. >.>;

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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by TyrannisUmbra » Sat May 18, 2013 2:51 pm

Kkat wrote:On a related note, is the amount of Trick Points too high? I've considered making the starting amount ([Agility + Charisma] / 2), rounded up, and reducing the bonus from Extra Tricks to 3 TP. This would mean that a pegasus doesn't start with the bulk of their TP fresh out of the gate, making level more important.
Drawing a parallel to strain costs for unicorns, on average it seems that pegasus tricks cost roughly 1/10 the number that unicorn spells do. Going to (AGI+CHA)/2 would bring starting TP down to around 1/6 the amount of starting strain unicorns get, if you don't factor in the base 30. Factoring that in... the base pool for pegasus tricks would roughly be between 1/10 to 1/12, which is pretty close.

Half-assed mathing aside, I think it would mostly depend on just how much you think a pegasus should be able to use from the start. (AGI+CHA)/2 on average would account for between 5 and 7 TP at Lv1, which makes for 5-7 generic basic tricks, 2-3 Lightning Kicks, or 1-2 Dodge and Weaves from full to empty. I'd say come up with some numbers for the amount of tricks you'd like to see them be able to do, and cater the starting amount to give those numbers.
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Thanqol
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Thanqol » Sat May 18, 2013 7:35 pm

I'd like to point out that the suggested damage for a cold-based Weaponised Contrail (And an attack with a weaponized winter storm cloud could be a savage hail-blast, dealing 20 + 3d10 damage, applied against triple the target’s DT, losing 1d10 damage each yard past short range and half base damage past medium) is a terrible decision. If the opponent has 2 points of DT then that cancels out the average damage gain of +1d10 DT. If they have 4 points of DT then you have lost damage and every point above that compounds the awfulness of the decision.

This is relevant to my interests as I'm playing a cold-themed Pegasus.

EDIT: I misread the damage on the base strike, meaning this line of argument is probably irrelevant.
Last edited by Thanqol on Sat May 18, 2013 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Viewing_Glass
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Viewing_Glass » Sat May 18, 2013 8:09 pm

I think that was a typo Thanqol. The hailburst would deal (20+3d10)*Flight Rank, DT multiplied by 3, with the cut off. This trick has a bit of leeway in whether Shotgun Surgeon would effect it or not...which would be up to the GM.

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Thanqol
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Thanqol » Sat May 18, 2013 8:15 pm

Viewing_Glass wrote:I think that was a typo Thanqol. The hailburst would deal (20+3d10)*Flight Rank, DT multiplied by 3, with the cut off. This trick has a bit of leeway in whether Shotgun Surgeon would effect it or not...which would be up to the GM.
Even if that's so, +3d10 at FR3 is cancelled out by 6DT in addition to the range penalties.

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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Viewing_Glass » Sat May 18, 2013 8:35 pm

Yeah...but honestly, combat magic isn't supposed to be the end all and be all. Otherwise other races start feeling bad because they don't have combat magic. >.>;

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Thanqol
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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by Thanqol » Sat May 18, 2013 9:08 pm

Viewing_Glass wrote:Yeah...but honestly, combat magic isn't supposed to be the end all and be all. Otherwise other races start feeling bad because they don't have combat magic. >.>;
This is a ridiculous argument. This is a variation of the trick that is horribly underpowered. The default version of the trick is much better. The problem is with the underpowered variation, not a philosophical discussion on the role and fairness of combat magic.

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Re: Alternate Core Documents

Post by TyrannisUmbra » Sat May 18, 2013 9:46 pm

I'd also like to point out that unless a combat spell is worth using, nobody will use it. And if nobody will use it, it might as well not exist. And that's no fun for anypony. That's one thing we learned from the big unicorn rework.
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Another thing we learned from the big unicorn rework... combat magic should be viable as a main source of offensive damage if a character builds for it (As long as it's not stronger by default, nor vastly weaker once fully built -- otherwise it might as well not exist in the first place, in game terms.) The idea being, perks make your 'class'. If you want to be a pegasus acrobat, it should be a viable build option, as long as you're investing the perks to make it one.
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